tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post142882011029439822..comments2024-03-27T11:27:31.790-05:00Comments on A Catholic Life: Let Them Be OneMatthewhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07929374709032473716noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-65922162400177839222007-02-01T01:59:00.000-06:002007-02-01T01:59:00.000-06:00your attitude is essentially not Christian at all,...your attitude is essentially not Christian at all, but fascist...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-55339747336385861042007-01-24T06:37:00.000-06:002007-01-24T06:37:00.000-06:00Thus, we are a church of sinners, and we are not p...<i>Thus, we are a church of sinners, and we are not perfect. You cannot honestly be justifying the Inquisitions? or our antisemitic acts? </i><br /><br />The Church is made up of sinners, but the Church remains perfect. It is the bride of Christ! She is without blemish in all of her dogmas and doctrine. <br /><br />The Inquisition WAS NOT bad. People claim that many people were killed and tortured, but that simply isn't true. Statistically, no one was tortured more than once in the Inquisition. It was a time where heretics were removed from teaching their lies. <br /><br />And I don't think Ut Unum Sint says anything along the lines of "Catholics may attend protestant services". We have to realize that no papal encyclical can be contradicted. It would be wrong for Catholics to attend protestant services.Matthewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07929374709032473716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-62862711476168520312007-01-24T03:27:00.000-06:002007-01-24T03:27:00.000-06:00For me, the issue is simple. Is the Catholic Churc...For me, the issue is simple. Is the Catholic Church the One Church founded by the Lord Jesus Christ?<br /><br />The Vatican II Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, Lumen Gentium has this to say:<br /><br />This is the one Church of Christ which in the Creed is professed as one, holy, catholic and apostolic, which our Saviour, after His Resurrection, commissioned Peter to shepherd, and him and the other apostles to extend and direct with authority, which He erected for all ages as "the pillar and mainstay of the truth". This Church constituted and organized in the world as a society, subsists in the Catholic Church, which is governed by the successor of Peter and by the Bishops in communion with him, although many elements of sanctification and of truth are found outside of its visible structure.<br /><br />God alone knows how much grief and confusion the unfortunate choice of subsists in has brought to the Church. And elements of sanctification do not a Church make.<br /><br />As St. Cyprian of Carthage said, you can't have God as your Father if you don't have the Church as you Mother. Extra ecclesiam nulla salus!.<br /><br />So, back to my point. I'm a pretty simple minded guy. So the question in simple terms for me is this. Is the Catholic Church the One Church founded by Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ? If yes, then all men must be called to come into Her, the Ark of Salvation.<br /><br />Why cling to little boats and be tossed about by every wind of doctrine when one can come into the Barque of Peter and be steered into the Harbour of Heaven?<br /><br />But is the Catholic Church is not the Church founded by Our Lord Jesus Christ, then why are these hierarchs in Her? Should we not be looking high and low for this pearl of great price?<br /><br />If we believe that the Catholic Church be the One True Church founded by her Lord, then the ecumenism of return is the only way, as distasteful as it might seem to our politically sensitive ears. But if Truth is what we want to pursue, then that's the only way. All, Orthodox, Non-Chalcedonian, Protestant(Anglican's inclusive), pagans, heathens, agnostics and atheists, without exception, must be called into union with her, for the salvation of their won souls.<br /><br />Why must we sacrifice the truth, painful as it might be for these people to hear it, for the sake pleasing their ears when hearing the truth(though perhaps articulated a little more charitably than here =)) could save their souls? The salvation of souls is the prime goal and highest good of the Church. If we forget this, then we'd better close the shop down.Andrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09356738924839809045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-26053672494008203852007-01-23T07:06:00.000-06:002007-01-23T07:06:00.000-06:00One more thing:
If all papal encyclicals "never c...One more thing:<br /><br />If all papal encyclicals "never can be contradicted", how do you explain the difference in attitude between the encyclical you cited and Ut Unum Sint?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-76859337001061553302007-01-23T07:05:00.000-06:002007-01-23T07:05:00.000-06:00This comment has been removed by the author.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-27123167153300154172007-01-23T07:03:00.000-06:002007-01-23T07:03:00.000-06:00Who is in the church, MB? We are, and speaking fo...Who is in the church, MB? We are, and speaking for myself at least, I am a sinner. Thus, we are a church of sinners, and we are not perfect. You cannot honestly be justifying the Inquisitions? or our antisemitic acts? <br /><br />You're missing the point with ecumenism. Nobody is going to change creeds or water down the truth. What will happen is we will come to an amicable understanding of certain issues like governance because the Pope is the contentious issue between us and the Anglicans. The Filioque clause and governance is the contentious issue between us and the East. <br /><br />Read up on some ecumenical documents that are recent, MB. There you'll see that we have made huge strides already, none of which compromise the truth in our church, but all of which admit that EVERY CHURCH HAS A SEED OF TRUTH. They're not all wrong because they're United, or Baptist, or Anglican, or Mormons. We need to respect that before we kill ecumenism thoughtlessly. <br /><br />We need to start with a sense of humility and ask for forgiveness from those we have hurt before we'll make any strides at all.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-18101084907961731262007-01-22T22:13:00.000-06:002007-01-22T22:13:00.000-06:00Perfectly said, Andrew.Perfectly said, Andrew.Matthewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07929374709032473716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-54082387796294678592007-01-22T22:00:00.000-06:002007-01-22T22:00:00.000-06:00For me, the issue is simple. Is the Catholic Churc...For me, the issue is simple. Is the Catholic Church the One Church founded by the Lord Jesus Christ?<br /><br />The Vatican II Dogmatic Constitution on the Church, Lumen Gentium has this to say:<br /><br />This is the one Church of Christ which in the Creed is professed as one, holy, catholic and apostolic, which our Saviour, after His Resurrection, commissioned Peter to shepherd, and him and the other apostles to extend and direct with authority, which He erected for all ages as "the pillar and mainstay of the truth". This Church constituted and organized in the world as a society, subsists in the Catholic Church, which is governed by the successor of Peter and by the Bishops in communion with him, although many elements of sanctification and of truth are found outside of its visible structure.<br /><br />God alone knows how much grief and confusion the unfortunate choice of subsists in has brought to the Church. And elements of sanctification do not a Church make.<br /><br />As St. Cyprian of Carthage said, you can't have God as your Father if you don't have the Church as you Mother. Extra ecclesiam nulla salus!.<br /><br />So, back to my point. I'm a pretty simple minded guy. So the question in simple terms for me is this. Is the Catholic Church the One Church founded by Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ? If yes, then all men must be called to come into Her, the Ark of Salvation.<br /><br />Why cling to little boats and be tossed about by every wind of doctrine when one can come into the Barque of Peter and be steered into the Harbour of Heaven?<br /><br />But is the Catholic Church is not the Church founded by Our Lord Jesus Christ, then why are these hierarchs in Her? Should we not be looking high and low for this pearl of great price?<br /><br />If we believe that the Catholic Church be the One True Church founded by her Lord, then the ecumenism of return is the only way, as distasteful as it might seem to our politically sensitive ears. But if Truth is what we want to pursue, then that's the only way. All, Orthodox, Non-Chalcedonian, Protestant(Anglican's inclusive), pagans, heathens, agnostics and atheists, without exception, must be called into union with her, for the salvation of their won souls.<br /><br />Why must we sacrifice the truth, painful as it might be for these people to hear it, for the sake pleasing their ears when hearing the truth(though perhaps articulated a little more charitably than here =)) could save their souls? The salvation of souls is the prime goal and highest good of the Church. If we forget this, then we'd better close the shop down.Andrewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09356738924839809045noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-54768262874356339402007-01-22T09:46:00.000-06:002007-01-22T09:46:00.000-06:00A papal encyclical can not become old and out of u...A papal encyclical can not become old and out of use. A papal encyclical cannot be contradicted - it will always apply to the Church!<br /><br /><i>We're not perfect</i><br /><br />The Catholic Church's Doctrine is perfect because Jesus Christ is perfect.Matthewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07929374709032473716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-81889673353572497842007-01-22T07:24:00.000-06:002007-01-22T07:24:00.000-06:00Moneybags:
Ecumenism is something sought after by...Moneybags:<br /><br />Ecumenism is something sought after by the pontificate these days, so posting out-of-date papal encyclicals from eras when there were different concerns is not very helpful. What about Pope B16's trip to Turkey and his meetings there in the name of ecumenism? Unity is a good thing, and Catholics have done enough damage over time (think Inquisitions, think "Filioque clause", etc.) to cause rifts. We're not perfect, nor is any other Church, but dialogue and mutual respect is what is critical.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-71860582466642820032007-01-22T05:19:00.000-06:002007-01-22T05:19:00.000-06:00Just thought that you should know that the quote i...Just thought that you should know that the quote in your post did not originate from Pope John Paul II. It's actually from a document entitled "Notification relative to the book of Jacques Dupuis, Toward a Christian Theology of Religious Pluralism" from the CDF under the prefecture of the former Cardinal Ratzinger, now His Holiness Pope Benedict XVI. It can be found here. The CDF also published a commentary on the text of the notification that can be found here. Perhaps you might want to correct that.<br /><br />-Deo Juvante-Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-29376511473097259032007-01-22T03:40:00.000-06:002007-01-22T03:40:00.000-06:00great post MB. i am no fan of false ecumenism, it...great post MB. i am no fan of false ecumenism, it gives a sense of unity when really, we are not united. there is no unity unless we all speak the same thing, that there be no schisms among us, and we be perfect in mind and in the same judgement. to accomplish this, we must all assent to the teachings of Christ as taught by the one, holy, catholic and apostolic Church. even if one loves Jesus, one reads the bible, one has faith in the Trinity, conversion to the Church is necessary. though these truths or elements of the Church exist in false religions, they are not sufficient for salvation, they are supposed to impel toward unity, towards conversion to the Church. <br /><br />St. Augustine (354-430), Bishop and Doctor of the Church: "No man can find salvation except in the Catholic Church. Outside the Catholic Church one can have everything except salvation. One can have honor, one can have sacraments, one can sing alleluia, one can answer amen, one can have faith in the Name of the Father and the Son and of the Holy Ghost, and preach it too, but never can one find salvation except in the Catholic Church."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-40341704117926006742007-01-21T19:20:00.000-06:002007-01-21T19:20:00.000-06:00Until there is a change in the attitude that this ...Until there is a change in the attitude that this kind of post perpetuates, there will be no chance of Christian unity.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13804788.post-3588493017593821802007-01-21T16:08:00.000-06:002007-01-21T16:08:00.000-06:00St. Augustine notes: "In essentials, unity; in non...St. Augustine notes: "In essentials, unity; in non-essentials, liberty; and in all things, charity."AChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01404498383807879849noreply@blogger.com